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 Pro-Life...Pro-Choice...Both?
Pro-Life...Pro-Choice...Both?
A good article outlining both sides of the debate picked by theclansman 1 year ago
tags life abortion choice
 quote edit #1 

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17
 JoshSF49
1 year ago
« badbud :That little lump of cells is very much alive. (just like your hamburger was a few days ago) It is however a parasite, living and growing inside the body of another human being. It is completely dependent on that lone individual. That lone individual has the right to determine her own fate, and the fate of that fetus.
A parasite lives in or on its host and it sucks the life out of the host. It is a harmful relationship.

A child still developing is not a parasite, and it disgusts me that you would call a human being a parasite.
quote #2
23
 BADbud
1 year ago
several definitions of a parasite

1 An organism that grows, feeds, and is sheltered on or in a different organism while contributing nothing to the survival of its host.

2 something that resembles a biological parasite in dependence on something else for existence or support without making a useful or adequate return

3An organism that lives in or on and takes its nourishment from another organism. A parasite cannot live independently.
quote #3
17
 JoshSF49
1 year ago
« BADbud : several definitions of a parasite

1 An organism that grows, feeds, and is sheltered on or in a different organism while contributing nothing to the survival of its host.

2 something that resembles a biological parasite in dependence on something else for existence or support without making a useful or adequate return

3An organism that lives in or on and takes its nourishment from another organism. A parasite cannot live independently.
I know what a parasite is.

Regardless, that fetus eventually leaves the mother and lives on its own. It's not a new species; it is not a new organism. It is in a different stage of life. I see z/e/f as stages of a life, just like infant, toddler, child, teenager, and adult. An infant can't live independently by itself, and it is outside the mother. It breastfeeds. That doesn't mean it is a parasite.

I guess it's all up to your definition of a "useful" return.
quote #4
23
 BADbud
1 year ago
« JoshSF49 A child still developing is not a parasite, and it disgusts me that you would call a human being a parasite.
A developing embryo is be definition a parasite.

For you, parasite has a bad connotation. For others it's just another noun.

Parasite is not a bad word, it is a word.
quote #5
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22
 lynxears
1 year ago
« JoshSF49 : A parasite lives in or on its host and it sucks the life out of the host. It is a harmful relationship.
This could be the exact definition of a developing child. And it could be seen as a harmful relationship, depending on the point of view.
I mean, it definitely lives in its host and sucks the life out of her. This is one reason so many women die during childbirth, and/or complications to pregnancy.

As for the harmful relationship, consider the babies that make their mother diabetic for the duration of the pregnancy. Or that have a blood type so different from the mother that the body attacks it as a foreign body.
quote #6
7
 skitzori...
1 year ago
« TraumaMamma :
Population control irks me I guess...
.... much like culling animals in the wild.
Sadly, I personally believe that some people are no better than animals. I am all for population control, I don't want to be stumbling over all the unwanted children my old high school peers are chucking out on the street while I go from my porch to my motorcycle. Some of the idiotic people I know should be told that they can't have kids. Its kind of odd that people try to make this a government issue. As per an above comment, people should not be told they have to have kids, if the government cannot tell them they cant. Back on topic though, I know that at this stage of my life, any kid I would have would be horrifically uncared for. I simply would not have the ability. I think that a child that will grow up with terrible emotional scarring from lack of parent's providing ability or caring, is better off aborted. I think there is nothing crueler than giving birth to an unwanted child.
quote #7
17
 JoshSF49
1 year ago
« BADbud : A developing embryo is be definition a parasite.

For you, parasite has a bad connotation. For others it's just another noun.

Parasite is not a bad word, it is a word.
I don't understand how you don't see parasite with a bad connotation.

Regardless, parasite or not, it is still a human being. It will never be anything but a human being, and we should not disregard the life of the baby.
quote #8
2
 andraja
1 year ago
« lynxears : That's when the process of growth begins for the embryo, but there is dispute over whether an embryo is "alive."
Apologies. You're right. As I said, according to the medical profession, that is when growth begins, and I should've said that..arguably, most people would say that is what classifies as life. I accidentally implied that's what medicine believes as well.

I, however, don't believe it's "alive" at that point. Perhaps when the fetus has a fully developed nervous system, then it's alive.
quote #9
22
 lynxears
1 year ago
« JoshSF49 :  It will never be anything but a human being, and we should not disregard the life of the baby.
I'm just playing devil's advocate now.

It could be (and will be) a lump of cells. Is the lump of cells, when it is separate egg and sperm (before combining) a human?

What of babies that are so severely deformed they cannot live outside of the womb? (Spina bifida) What about miscarriages? Is someone to blame that the baby/potential baby died before finishing growth?
quote #10
26
 tundramo...
1 year ago
« lynxears:What of babies that are so severely deformed they cannot live outside of the womb? (Spina bifida) What about miscarriages? Is someone to blame that the baby/potential baby died before finishing growth?
What about the scores of unused embryos destroyed after IVF? If abortion is outlawed, will this make couples who undergo IVF murderers since not every embryo is used?

/devil's advocate
quote #11
26
 tundramo...
1 year ago
« yoornotme : It is her sadness that made me start questioning my stance on abortion. I don't know where I stand now, but I don't think I'm strictly pro-life anymore.
Opinions on the issue at hand aside, I think it's awesome that you still have an open enough mind and that your system of beliefs is fluid enough to change a bit with substantial reason.

Never lose this ability! Too many people keep their blinders on and refuse to change their minds about anything because "this is the way it's always been." If everyone employed critical thinking, I think the world wouldn't have half the problems it does!
quote #12
22
 lynxears
1 year ago
« tundramonkey : What about the scores of unused embryos destroyed after IVF? If abortion is outlawed, will this make couples who undergo IVF murderers since not every embryo is used?

/devil's advocate
I like the way you think, missy.

Also, the IVF embryos have already created a pro-life stink. Well, kinda. A pro-life, anti-stem-cell research stink. People argued that using the throw-away embryos for stem cell research was killing a child... but they were going to be thrown away (in the trash!) regardless! Stupid people!
quote #13
32
 yoornotm...
1 year ago
« tundramonkey : Opinions on the issue at hand aside, I think it's awesome that you still have an open enough mind and that your system of beliefs is fluid enough to change a bit with substantial reason.

Never lose this ability! Too many people keep their blinders on and refuse to change their minds about anything because "this is the way it's always been." If everyone employed critical thinking, I think the world wouldn't have half the problems it does!
Thank you, Monkey. That means a lot to me :)
quote #14
10
 sidran32
1 year ago
« lynxears : No, actually, medical science refuses to "definitively" answer this. That's when the process of growth begins for the embryo, but there is dispute over whether an embryo is "alive."
Actually, this is incorrect. I would highly recommend reading this paper on the subject:

The question of when a new human life begins (or, a new organism is formed) is a purely scientific question, and not one of faith or personal belief, by any means.
quote #15
22
 lynxears
1 year ago
« sidran32 : Actually, this is incorrect. I would highly recommend reading this paper on the subject:

The question of when a new human life begins (or, a new organism is formed) is a purely scientific question, and not one of faith or personal belief, by any means.
Interesting. I can't read this now, but I'll look at it.
But the question is hardly purely scientific. Even if the entire scientific community were to come out with one "final" answer to this question (which I highly highly doubt is the case or ever will be), it will not matter. But if the Pope came out tomorrow saying fetuses are not alive, you betcha there'd be a reaction.
quote #16
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